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I am a long term White Wolf fan. The first RPG I cared about was Ars Magica 3rd Ed, which in turn coloured my opinion on the Tremere in Vampire: the Masquerade and the Order of Hermes in Mage: the Ascension for years afterwards (I regarded them as poor reproductions of their mighty heyday. On reflection I realise that they were my favourite clan/order. To this day I regret not playing a Tremere.)
The first game I successfully ran as a Storyteller was Masquerade.
I played V:tM, M:tAs, Changeling: the Dreaming (1st Ed, with Bunk Cards), Werewolf: the Apocalypse, Dark Ages, Aeon Trilogy (Trinity/Aberrant/Adventure! [Best game ever]), Hunter: the Reckoning, Orpheus and Exalted 1st Ed.
I embraced the new World of Darkness games when they came out, preferring the revised Storytelling system over the old Storyteller one.
I lamented the apparent death of White Wolf as its parent company, CCP, had to regroup and restructure in the changing economic climate and effectively closed WW down, and I genuinely rejoiced when Rich Thomas set up Onyx Path Publishing and secured the rights to continue publishing new gaming material for the World of Darkness.

All of the above is a long way of saying “I love White Wolf/World of Darkness games and am one of the faithful”.

Which, in turn, leads to this post and me expressing my concerns about updated rule set being introduced with the God Machine Chronicles and the new Demon game.
One of the things I looked about the new WoD was that every game used the same system, same skills, same mechanics and that every game was able to mechanically cross over with each other without having to fudge the incongruities.
This changes with Demon, as it uses a revised Storytelling system as laid out in the God Machine.

As far as I can tell, to play Demon you need to own the World of Darkness core rule book, Demon and the God Machine.
I can also see that some of the core mechanics have changed so that examples of game play read significantly differently.

So, my question is, are the rules contained within the World of Darkness core book actually broken?
If they are broken, then surely a second edition is warranted rather than an additional supplement?

I guess that there are marketing concerns at work. Onyx Path do not own the games or the system, so maybe CCP don’t want a new edition of every single game coming out.
Maybe Onyx Path decided against a second edition because they wanted to retain the good faith of their players.

At the moment though I am keen to see what Demon is, but very reserved about the system updates.

Update
The Onyx Path G+ account (which I think is Ian Watson) had informed me that the rules updates will be available for free, and there is no need to buy the God Machine to get them.
Which is very good.

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11 thoughts on “Is it really broken? / Why not just commit to a Second Edition?

  1. I did consider taking a picture of all my WW books, including Werewolf: the Forsaken, Changeling: the Lost, Promethean, Hunter: the Vigil and Mage: the Awakening, but the pile would also have Pathfinder and Gumshoe books in them.
    Although I hope you're not counting Ars Magica as non-WW. It's as good as…

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  2. I think you should also keep in mind I don't think the NWoD rules are broken. Talking with Rose, Rich, David and others who have been involved I have not been given the impression they really thought they were broken either. It's just that they can be improved upon and right about now is the time in the life cycle of the game line to be looking at things like that.

    All these years of playtesting have shown them how to take a good product and make it better.

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  3. I can appreciate that, I guess I'm wondering why they've taken this approach and not gone with a second edition.
    In my mind I'm comparing it with WotC decision to update D&D from 3rd Ed to 3.5.
    It may just be that times are very different now and maybe updating the whole nWoD lines just wouldn't fly the same way that cWoD could with second and revised editions.

    Maybe i just fear change.

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  4. I completely agree with your concerns. I too have them. I really feel that new WOD, (or as you call it, second edition) is fine the way that it is. If Onyx really wanted to update the rules they should do so for all, not just piecemeal. I realize they cant do a new edition (CCP has told them no). But I feel that the game as is works perfectly, particularly with the vast library of supplements that have updated it in the last 2-3 years.

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  5. Them making the rules updates freely available online is an amazing step.

    I wanted to migrate over as it was based on what I'd read, but was concerned that others would be hesitant and unwilling to spend the money to update what they already own and know.

    I guess there'll be no excuses.
    I'm really hoping that Mummy is fully compatible since it just got released.

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  6. Really? They appear to be doing well enough with their 20th anniversary editions and I personally have high hopes for the Onyx Path owned Aeon Continuum and Scion lines.
    Hopefully the release of Mummy, Demon and Exalted 3 this year will restore the game live and publishing houses to an even keel.

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